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Author Topic: Finally Bought a Decent Keyboard - "Unicomp" (aka IBM clicky classic)  (Read 1496 times)

G0ddard B0lt

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I am incredibly fussy about the computer keyboard that I use:

- The keys have to be "full travel" and have separation in 3D. (No low-profile Microsoft and other brand "Ergo" keyboards for me.)
- It has to be durable (it can't wear out in important ways.)

I originally purchased a Keytronic keyboard ("Lifetime" product line, "Designer P2", black for the PC I built a few years ago:



It has the attributes I described above with one important difference. The key faces are just printed on. As you may be able to make out from the photo, the paint has worn off of the most used keys.

Although it was not a show stopper, I want to mention that the Keytronic's keys do not click. I think the technology is some kind of membrane push switch. The feel of the keys bottoming out is nice. One quibble is that occasionally a couple of keys get stuck "down" from misalignment and mutual rubbing.

The Keytronic was about $35. I *think* Keytronic would replace the keyboard if it is defective, and their Lifetime line is marketed as its name implies - a "forever" solution - but I really wanted a keyboard that could stand up.

So it's not durable for my purposes. In low room light only the most-unused keys are readable. I can generally type (hunt and peck) by touch and memory but often I search for a "home" key. I want to be able to read the keys in all light levels.

We have Micro Center here and a couple of weeks ago I bought, and then returned, a gamer style keyboard with a very nice key layout. All the key legends illuminate (backlit.) The problem was that you have to be looking straight down at the keys to read them. I returned it - it was just annoying to use. (That one was $130 with tax, too much to keep something I don't really like that much.)

I finally zeroed in on two viable choices:

- The "Das Keyboard" with "Cherry" brand "Blue" keys, which click. (Cherry blue and Cherry brown seem to be the marks for nicer gamer and office keyboards.) This would be about $100-$120.

- Unicomp, described next.

For several years I have debated the following keyboard, which I finally wound up buying. It is made by an independent, US based vendor named Unicomp. Unicomp is based in Lexington, KY and acquired the IBM patents and manufacturing technology for the "clicky" keyboard that IBM manufactured in Lexington for a few decades.

Unicomp is a small vendor and is a bit difficult to get specific information from. Nobody seems to staff their phones, and they were unresponsive to support emails. Finally I used the web site's live chat feature and "summoned" a support person the other day to answer a few questions.

I wanted to know what ink or marking technology was used to imprint the key tops. The guy replied that their keys are baked with the imprinting. He said that the only way to wear the legends off is to sand the keys down. That satisfied me.

So I ordered the "Buckling spring 101 key classic", with a black case and black printed on white keys.



The deliberate intent is that it is supposed to look (form factor wise) exactly like the keyboards sold with the original IBM-PCs. And, of course, it feels like them, too.

I got a PS2 type interface. USB is available for all of their stuff. I preferred PS2 because most motherboards are more responsive to PS2 during BIOS boot than USB, and sometimes I go in and tinker with settings (with USB keyboards it can be difficult to wake the BIOS to the setup mode. ) If I ever need straight USB, there are cheap adapters available.

I suspect that this is one of my smartest investments ever in a home office. With ground shipping it was about $90. I got it in two days (I am only 100 mi. from Lexington.)

TRexx, resident mensch in all that is IBM, do you have one? I would think you at least gave this model a long, hard look.

It seems to be great.
« Last Edit: August 10, 2012, 07:32:28 am by The Gorn »
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TRexx

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Re: Finally Bought a Decent Keyboard - "Unicomp" (aka IBM clicky classic)
« Reply #1 on: August 10, 2012, 07:55:58 am »
TRexx, resident mensch in all that is IBM, do you have one? I would think you at least gave this model a long, hard look.

I wish I did and now that I know they are available I certainly will look at them.  (I recall someone was retrofitting the solid steel 3270 keyboards to be PC compatible,  Now that was keyboard) 



My current is a Saitek "MultiMedia". I like the look and feel, but the when I connect it to my KVM switch the multimedia buttons stop working.

I also have problem with the letters wearing off the keys.  I bought some stick-on replacements that lasted  about 6 months before they peeled off and left a sticky residue that attracted all kinds of dust. My current fix is to print the alphabet on my Brother label printer, stick them on the keys and then cover each one with a piece of Scotch Tape. 

Doesn't this look great? (Notice the absence of the "CapsLock" the first thing I do with any new keyboard is pry that off.

 

PhilFromNY

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Re: Finally Bought a Decent Keyboard - "Unicomp" (aka IBM clicky classic)
« Reply #2 on: August 10, 2012, 08:21:39 am »
Maybe I'm just felling overly cynical today but the first thing that popped into my head when I read this posting was that the only reason Unicomp would still be making the keyboards is to satisfy government contracts. It's a pain updating those requirement documents.

G0ddard B0lt

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Re: Finally Bought a Decent Keyboard - "Unicomp" (aka IBM clicky classic)
« Reply #3 on: August 10, 2012, 08:27:11 am »
Maybe I'm just felling overly cynical today but the first thing that popped into my head when I read this posting was that the only reason Unicomp would still be making the keyboards is to satisfy government contracts. It's a pain updating those requirement documents.

I'll bet you're right. There would seem to be no other good reason to keep a keyboard factory in the US in operation. I should look around and see if there are GSA schedules on their site.

TRexx, I found a thread where you describe this keyboard when you first bought it, the Saitek, which I found at Wal-Mart for about $45, which I promptly returned because it felt like junk, although I agree that it had a nice feel otherwise.

http://archive.computerconsultantsforum.com/programming-and-technology/modern-keyboards-without-crappy-laptop-like-chicklet-keys/msg17318/#msg17318

I am using the Unicomp right now. Clicky clicky clicky.

One demerit - it has little desktop friction owing to almost non existent rubber feet so it wants to slide. I need to get some of that mesh like shelf liner and cut a piece to anchor it.

OH! One "problem", and too late now. No Windows key! :(

www.unicomp.com

I didn't look into this next place, which seems to offer "new old" stocks of vintage IBM keyboards. I am sure it's straightforward to find an IBM-PC to PS2 adapter.

http://www.clickykeyboards.com/
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I D Shukhov

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Re: Finally Bought a Decent Keyboard - "Unicomp" (aka IBM clicky classic)
« Reply #4 on: August 11, 2012, 03:21:06 am »
I'm typing this on a Northgate OmniKey 101.  I think I bought it in 1993.   After agonizing over the cost, which was well in excess of $100 (about $200 in today's dollars), I decided that it would improve my user experience, and it has, and does, 19 years later.

Be Prepared.

G0ddard B0lt

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Re: Finally Bought a Decent Keyboard - "Unicomp" (aka IBM clicky classic)
« Reply #5 on: August 11, 2012, 07:13:22 am »
I'm typing this on a Northgate OmniKey 101.  I think I bought it in 1993.   After agonizing over the cost, which was well in excess of $100 (about $200 in today's dollars), I decided that it would improve my user experience, and it has, and does, 19 years later.

Yeah - you mentioned that in the earlier (2007) thread about keyboards, too. I looked that up. There is a guy on Ebay who sells a reconditioning/cleaning service of the keys on Northgate Omnikey keyboards. They do appear to have a cult following.

I remember that my first "real" computer, a PC clone, back in 1989, was purchased from a local chain with a fairly cheap keyboard that clicked. I am fairly certain that it clicked, but it was a bottom end keyboard anyway. It had a nice, decisive key feel. Much better than the middle of the road crap that is sold today.

And in 1996 I purchased a beige compact, PS2 compatible IBM keyboard at a Micro Center that didn't click but pretty much had the same "serious typist's" keyboard layout with nice vertical key profiles and good travel.

Today it's rather hard to find a keyboard that has decent, separated keys with a good amount of key travel. The medium range ergo keyboards are all the chicklet  type closely spaced, limited travel key style. Like it's wrong or something to make keys that look like individual buttons. The low profile stuff is seriously unusable but it's the most popular with sheeple.

If one is on a budget the better bets are actually the really cheap keyboards like the "Lite-On" that Newegg sells for < $10, and the cheap HP replacement keyboards that Walmart has.

The Keytronic Designer P2 keyboard is an excellent choice for a good budget keyboard and Newegg shows it being $30 right now. Its only problem so far is that the key paint wears off. If I had to work onsite at a client I would definitely take it along.
« Last Edit: August 11, 2012, 11:01:36 am by The Gorn »
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benali72

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I use old IBM keyboards
« Reply #6 on: August 11, 2012, 08:32:05 am »
I'm a touch-typist so I need a real office keyboard (not one made for home users or kids or techies who can't touch type).

I use old IBM PS/2 keyboards. I have several I've maintained, they've lasted for over 20 years.

I agree with what you say about USB vs round connector keyboards... if you do testing you really need the better responsiveness of the old round connector, USB's don't pick up early enough in the boot sequence.

A really good source of old keyboards is the town electronics dump. You'll see many people throw out perfectly good keyboards, just because you always get a new one bundled when you buy a new PC. Lots of ones they toss out are better than today's new keyboards.

Thanks for the good info in your post.

G0ddard B0lt

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Re: I use old IBM keyboards
« Reply #7 on: August 11, 2012, 11:05:56 am »
I agree with what you say about USB vs round connector keyboards... if you do testing you really need the better responsiveness of the old round connector, USB's don't pick up early enough in the boot sequence.

A really good source of old keyboards is the town electronics dump. You'll see many people throw out perfectly good keyboards, just because you always get a new one bundled when you buy a new PC. Lots of ones they toss out are better than today's new keyboards.

Thanks for the good info in your post.

USB is a *very* complex point to point networking protocol. To be USB-certified for a product can cost thousands of dollars. It actually surprises me that most BIOSs can detect a USB keyboard. The gamer keyboard that I got at Micro Center recently and returned was a wiz bang semi intelligent product with programmable keyboard macros and you needed a Windows only application that you download from the manufacturer to program the key macros.  ::) The instructions that were on the web site (nothing came in the box) said that if you had problems setting up the BIOS of a computer with that keyboard, swap out a PS2 keyboard temporarily.  >:(

Re: town dump - WOW, great idea. Also Goodwill, other hand me down sources. Do a thorough cleaning, though, don't want stranger cooties.  :laugh:
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Re: Finally Bought a Decent Keyboard - "Unicomp" (aka IBM clicky classic)
« Reply #8 on: August 11, 2012, 05:27:53 pm »
Re: Keyboard preferences - old style vs new...

I "get" that you like the old-style keyboards with a solid feel.  As someone with small hands, I actually do better on the newer keyboards doing touch typing.  I get less carpal tunnel with the lower profile keys.  So is it a "guy thing"  - this preference for large, solid keyboards?

Back in my Music Ed. days, I had trouble with some of the piano requirements - same problem.  I also do better with the smaller, student size guitars and violins.

Good thread.  I'm learning a lot I didn't know about keyboards. :)

Regards,
-DG

G0ddard B0lt

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Re: Finally Bought a Decent Keyboard - "Unicomp" (aka IBM clicky classic)
« Reply #9 on: August 11, 2012, 06:59:35 pm »
I "get" that you like the old-style keyboards with a solid feel.  As someone with small hands, I actually do better on the newer keyboards doing touch typing.  I get less carpal tunnel with the lower profile keys.  So is it a "guy thing"  - this preference for large, solid keyboards?

Back in my Music Ed. days, I had trouble with some of the piano requirements - same problem.  I also do better with the smaller, student size guitars and violins.

The specific problem that I have with laptop keyboards and all other keyboards that have closely spaced keys that have little travel is that I can't feel or sense where my fingers are. And on those type of keyboards, I tend to hit the wrong key constantly. My ease of typing is in proportion to the degree to which I can feel the keys as separate objects.

I am not a trained touch typist, but after 38 years of using some kind of computer keyboard, I can generally type sort of like a touch typist because I have learned the keyboard layout through sheer repetition. When I use a keyboard like this one, I can type without looking down at the keyboard. I make one typo every 10 to 50 or so characters, depending on my alertness level. (Right now I am tired, and I am making mistakes like crazy. But I can find the keys when I focus.)

My accuracy and hence my productivity on a laptop keyboard, even if I use it for a straight week on a trip, is very low, even at my best - I have to have the room light turned up and I must look down and position every finger at the key I want to strike and I have to see the key legends.

There is little difference in productivity for me to type an email on my laptop or to type it on the tiny slide out keyboard on my Android phone. Both are equally miserable. That's how badly the low profile keys work for me. I'm 5'7" and my hands are average size.

I believe everything you're saying as it applies to you. However, the marcomm for the "Das Keyboard" (just Google it, it's a high end keyboard) and other >$120 "professional" high end keyboards states that the plunger like key action and the click detent actually help carpal tunnel.

I have no idea, either way.
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TRexx

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Re: Finally Bought a Decent Keyboard - "Unicomp" (aka IBM clicky classic)
« Reply #10 on: August 15, 2012, 03:47:10 am »
I bought an Unicomp (USB) and really like it. Unfortunately when I plug it into my KVM switch it  isn't recognized. 

DarkHumour

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Re: Finally Bought a Decent Keyboard - "Unicomp" (aka IBM clicky classic)
« Reply #11 on: August 16, 2012, 01:13:57 pm »
I bought an Unicomp (USB) and really like it. Unfortunately when I plug it into my KVM switch it  isn't recognized.

Possible fix for that:

May have to uncheck the boxes for "allow this computer to turn off this device to save power" for all of the USB Root Hub properties.

Or reghack and hide/unhide the tab.  It blanket disables all of the usb root hubs options to save power.

HKLM\System\CurrentControlSet\Services\USB   

(Dword)  DisableSelectiveSuspend    1 to disable (hide tab) 0 to enable. 

TRexx

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Re: Finally Bought a Decent Keyboard - "Unicomp" (aka IBM clicky classic)
« Reply #12 on: August 18, 2012, 08:41:33 am »
I replaced my KVM and the new one handles the Unicomp keyboard nicely.  I thought that might be the culprit. I have never been happy with the KVM but when I bought it there were very few 4 port KVMs with USB support.

The old KVM (Raritan Switchman) occasionally goes brain dead or repeats the last key pressed -- rather dangerous if that key was Delete.  The only way to revive it is to unplug it's power cord and disconnect it from all the PCs. As long as it has a connection to a live PC is still draws power from the USB port.  I really wish manufacturers would include a power switch in their products.  I'm tired of crawling around under my desk to unplug some piece of gear.

New KVM (TrendNet TK-407K) seems to work OK. and it's small enough to fit on my desk.


unix

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Re: Finally Bought a Decent Keyboard - "Unicomp" (aka IBM clicky classic)
« Reply #13 on: October 14, 2018, 08:00:25 pm »
don't know how I missed that thread, valuable info here.

I run Das Keyboards. Cherry mx brown keys. I have several, including one built into the laptop. MSI Titan.

not mine but identical:



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ilconsiglliere

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Re: Finally Bought a Decent Keyboard - "Unicomp" (aka IBM clicky classic)
« Reply #14 on: October 15, 2018, 04:27:27 pm »
I am a touch typist. My high school was a college prep school (private) and we had a full semester of typing. I type like a fiend without looking at the keyboard because in order to pass the class I had to learn to do it. It stuck with me through college and than later when I was programming. People are fascinated about how fast I type without looking at the keyboard.

I hate those shallow flat button keyboards. I like the full travel and traditional IBM keyboards. I have a Lenovo USB keyboard that behaves like an old PS2 keyboard but has the Window keys.

Only thing that is a problem - because I am on a ton of conference calls I have to be careful with my typing because people can hear me typing and it drives them crazy. They commonly joke that its ilconsiglliere typing because I type really fast.

Apple and Lenovo laptop keyboards are not so bad but I would rather be on a full size keyboard.